Every child tells its own story - how can I hear it?

00:00:00: Music.

00:00:05: Hello and welcome to the children and books.

00:00:08: Today I'm with Luton and Rachel and we're gonna talk about how Stories can help.

00:00:15: Hello from here and I wish you a nice day

00:00:21: we have got just time to listen and we have got the guests today is Rachel Rachel

00:00:29: always with us with his English podcast and today we like to talk about her work with children and with stories

00:00:37: hi thank you very much nice to be here again we have some.

00:00:47: Interesting and maybe you come.

00:00:56: Yes I'm an art psychotherapist which means that I I work therapeutically with children and young people mainly.

00:01:06: But I do work adults too and I use the Arts as a medium of communication.

00:01:14: So we use art and the visual arts stories play.

00:01:23: And drama and movement and music in the work that we do together.

00:01:29: Do you know if got a favourite art which you like the most I guess I like I like using stories a lot actually my work.

00:01:42: Because stories are universal there are universal medium for communication.

00:01:48: And bacon can buy or provide all sorts of things guidance advice wisdom.

00:01:58: And even healing and.

00:02:03: I think it might have been Bruno bettelheim who said all sorrows can be born if you put them in a story or tell a story about them that means that everybody's store is contains somewhere within a story,

00:02:18: so everybody can identify,

00:02:21: the right story I guess and and Howie can you mention because I cannot imagine how how it looks like how do you how do we do it practically when are there was a child wears a problem.

00:02:36: Ok yeah so.

00:02:39: Children come in all different shapes and sizes and children who come to see me or often children who have are experiencing some difficulties,

00:02:49: I'm in the life of in the present moment or have may be experienced them in the past so there you know there may be barriers to communication

00:03:00: so we have to work hard at finding different ways to communicate and children communicate through play.

00:03:08: So that's that's great so I might start off with.

00:03:14: Using some some Play-Doh or something like that do you know what Play-Doh is it's kind of clay.

00:03:23: Hi yeah I've got some here I've got a model here so you might start with something you know plasticine clay that you can model.

00:03:37: And you just asked the child to make a shape and see whether they can make a creature from the shape.

00:03:46: And it doesn't have to be a creature that's recognisable so there's no right or wrong with it and then you can start thinking about I wonder what this creature likes to do.

00:03:57: But you know what does he like to do and what's its environment like so where does the creature live and from there you know.

00:04:08: The story and Mum.

00:04:12: Does a woman called Marie-Louise von Franz who did a lot of research into stories and fairy tales and she identified five elements contained within a story

00:04:26: so you have a main character and you have a quest.

00:04:32: Can quest and you have a helper.

00:04:42: And how whatever happens next how they overcome that obstacle.

00:04:48: And how the story continues or how it's resolved your character in so there's another method I use which is using those five elements of story making.

00:05:00: Where you almost used like a storyboard.

00:05:03: And you can in the first in the first box on the storyboard you draw the main character or sometimes you make the main character out of clay and so you yeah either.

00:05:18: You know either drawing it or creating it or using objects I have lots of a box of of interesting objects which might be too small,

00:05:30: is the precious stones in there there's.

00:05:37: He's feathers everyday objects pencil sharpeners things like that and see one stories,

00:05:46: developed from the objects by asking questions really and so some children.

00:05:51: We'll have lots of stories inside them and have lots of ideas and other children might be.

00:06:00: You know because of their experiences they might not be able to access that imaginative role within themselves they might be more than drawn and,

00:06:11: so in that case and I might be reading stories to children so we start you know so I provide the story.

00:06:19: Yeah talk to help them to get some words for what happens or what if you yeah yeah exactly and and I might choose a story that would resonate with that child.

00:06:34: And so I think.

00:06:39: Stories can a tune to the to the child's personal experience and then we can work with.

00:06:47: The story and the metaphor of the story and in that process the child can work with their own issues but it's distance,

00:06:57: so you provide yeah what we call an aesthetic distance so where a child might feel overwhelmed with their own.

00:07:06: Personal when looking at that inside a fictional story.

00:07:14: Then it becomes safer to look at we can we can hear the motivations actors we can look at the emotional world of the character and understand why they might why they do what they do.

00:07:29: In a way because it's not so close then it's exactly like you see it's the distance you provide you provide this distance and that in that space.

00:07:44: Can the healing can happen so it's where the child makes the connection with the story.

00:07:51: With the with the character in the story with the experience in the story.

00:07:56: And is the bad connection happens in that space between and that's where the healing happens that's where you can.

00:08:06: Clarify you can find me name you can find with them and you can.

00:08:13: You can resolve things in that space yeah.

00:08:19: So basically the children that you work with makeup you make up their own stories,

00:08:26: and maybe maybe see the story more abstract for more distance and can identify with the characters in these stories find guidance through the story,

00:08:41: make-up open maybe you give them the story.

00:08:45: Yeah that's it that's exactly it I think some children will

00:08:53: like I said we'll have lots of stories they'll help you there imagination is very rich and full.

00:09:00: And other children will struggle at little bit with that and in those cases then we might be.

00:09:09: Using stories that that I bring myself more stories you know stories that I get from from story books.

00:09:18: And sometimes children bring their favourite stories as well

00:09:26: did you what did your did your head to experience one that a try it was coming later to you and told you remember which story we we experience together.

00:09:41: Yes I mean for some you know I have worked with with with some children where we just work on the ones story

00:09:50: over and over and over and over again and and I guess you know,

00:09:58: I think does the aspect of the Hero's Journey in the story as well,

00:10:04: so have you heard of that idea the Hero's Journey so yeah and so.

00:10:13: So there's a there's a kind of maturation process a growing up through the story a developmental process for children,

00:10:22: can be guided through the story as well and often that's

00:10:29: that's a story that's already been written but it can also be their own story that they are.

00:10:36: The and the makers of them of their guidance you know because.

00:10:43: Very much I believe that we all have.

00:10:47: The power to heal ourselves comes from within each and every one of us it doesn't come from somebody else and my job is just to facilitate that to help.

00:10:57: Help the child find that and so be yeah so so they can.

00:11:06: Create that story from within and because it comes from within them it's part of the.

00:11:12: You know they they are every character in their story you know there's an aspect of them and every character in their story.

00:11:20: For me it's interesting that I think this repeating

00:11:25: of stories of sinks we do is so important and today we are looking at new things of new experiences but I think this.

00:11:37: Repeating and a little bit changing because every time every repetition is if another then what was before,

00:11:47: yes and you see something different in each repetition as well there's different the different awareness is different

00:11:55: you see different things you hear different things when you experience it differently depending on.

00:12:03: What's happened to you that day or what's happened to you that week you know your experiences you may find some insight into a different part of the story.

00:12:12: Yeah the guy started to look good films again and it was suggesting you experience it was icy I have seen other saying sent it was a news new experience India.

00:12:28: Stories are or so many stories in different cultures and there people think of stories everywhere on the world,

00:12:40: it's like a repetition and they're coming new stories everyday and and new things everyday.

00:12:49: Do you think stories on all or important for self-reflection and growth of why are people making up so many stories why are there

00:13:02: thinking of somebody stories absolutely I think all of that is important and I think people people make stories because they,

00:13:11: they have.

00:13:14: A story to tell but they also want the experience to be heard and to be witnessed by others because then invalidates,

00:13:23: experiences and you know even even infection because there's as I said earlier you know that the writer is in every part of the story that they write,

00:13:36: it might just be a small aspect of them or it might be an aspect of them that they hide that they they don't like to show so much so might be a shadow last night

00:13:46: but it's still there and it's in its and it's a very important part of the process to have those parts of oneself.

00:13:56: Speak to be seen to be heard and to be witnessed by others.

00:14:02: And that's part of the healing process as well that happens within the therapeutic process.

00:14:11: Yeah yeah what is your experience with writing stories in breaking news stories and what do you experience while writing.

00:14:23: I think it's not so far from the experience may be off the children because I at the beginning I take

00:14:31: heroes and I take a problem this is my main,

00:14:36: beginning and then I see what will happen and I think it's a kind of growing or a bit of feeling too because I've got my wounds like everybody

00:14:50: and I can hear it on my own way and in my own slowly naceur.

00:14:58: My own temple yeah bet your own pace yeah yeah in my own pace.

00:15:08: And you know I've I remember one little girl that I worked with and she has had the most awful experience in my life and.

00:15:22: She was she was very very uncontained that she was you know she was and she was,

00:15:31: she kinda filled the room for presents filled the room and and quite chaotic and so we started off by reading stories as a way to

00:15:43: to help contain some of that and I have a little maps and so we kind of sit on the mat to read the story at the end of the session and I start off with very very short stories

00:15:55: and,

00:15:57: developmentally like a very small picture book like a baby's picture book yeah and and she she eventually write her own story.

00:16:08: And it was full of the mice grease and monsters and characters that you really really scary.

00:16:18: She developed them in in clay.

00:16:24: Model them first and in that process she she gained control of some of the monsters in her life.

00:16:32: Metaphorically but in reality because she was she was actually doing it and putting them in the stories and.

00:16:43: And very much so wanted me to take care of the monsters and put them in a box at the end of the stories at the end of the session.

00:16:52: The stories for her and so everything was contained with you now.

00:16:59: Within my therapy room.

00:17:04: It didn't go out therapy room and as a result she was able to contain herself much more so the result was that she wasn't as chaotic and as you know

00:17:15: yeah because when you when you hit like a like a model

00:17:22: to to put in hands then maybe a little step to get the paper bit more control

00:17:30: we are all the things inside because you can name it you can give him you can tell an emotion with a sore.

00:17:40: What what what was happening

00:17:45: yeah absolutely and also you know we can act stories out as well so we can become the characters in the stories and that's always great fun and that was something I did with that little girl as well with me we became the characters

00:17:59: and take great Delight in,

00:18:03: in kind of casting me as the united the character that got trodden on all that

00:18:10: ok you know that got left behind and yet or not like you said it is so important that you witnessed it,

00:18:20: cousin Itt settling in her mind a have let's his true that is really here I I told it I get a reaction

00:18:30: to my story yes when children feel powerless they can take on the.

00:18:39: The character of the powerful person in the story so they they can they can have a.

00:18:46: A sense of an experience of what it is like to be powerful and you know play with that power for a little while maybe you know using it in not such a good way as well but doing it in the face,

00:18:59: yeah,

00:19:00: you know they maybe don't have it inside at the beginning that they can create with your help and with you witnessing our full power inside.

00:19:13: Which assists in developing yeah yeah and they can try out new ways of being as well.

00:19:23: What is a great great thing with stories

00:19:31: and such a great topic and it's it is it's absolutely universal isn't it there's been you know the tradition of oral,

00:19:41: storytelling yeah since since the beginning of of humankind

00:19:48: have been told and pasta on and in that retelling it's you know

00:19:58: knowledge and wisdom has been passed on to other Generations and then you learning from one generation is then and have passed on again and the stories might change a little bit with the Newark is Eamon you learn,

00:20:12: let it goes on and on and on yeah it's just the human thing yeah.

00:20:20: Yeah it's a very human thing because you know we wouldn't we wouldn't be interested in stories if we didn't have that emotional connection to them if we didn't have that identifier.

00:20:32: Yeah we can connect to because we know that this story is also a story a little bit maybe.

00:20:42: Yeah you like a person who is listening or who is reacting to it you have your own.

00:20:49: The emotions and reactants and all around for you too.

00:20:54: Yeah this is great.

00:21:00: At 25 minutes now and it was such a great conversation,

00:21:07: it was like we went to the ocean and twins through the water listening it's something to talk about.

00:21:22: Thank you thank you so much.

00:21:27: And that that I think everybody who is listening to it because we are not everyday confronted to this question so was this experience is so

00:21:37: it's just interesting to eat to hear it and to be a to be a kind of witness of a witnessing yeah sure,

00:21:46: maybe

00:21:49: you could do the nice ultra you do that you have been today our helper and our guest bowl.

00:22:04: And I wish everybody a nice day and a nice evening you hear us next time.

00:22:14: Music.